Sculpture Community - Sculpture.net  

Go Back  Sculpture Community - Sculpture.net > Community Announcements > Polls
User Name
Password
Home Sculpture Community Photo Gallery ISC Sculpture.org Register FAQ Members List Search New posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-07-2009, 04:13 PM
Glacierspirits Glacierspirits is offline
Level 3 user
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 40
Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Would you say in today's world, the modern era, is more impressed with fine art, or less then in times from the past? I'm not talking sales volume, or public support, but rather the overall "ahhh" factor we all look for. Are people in general more, or less impressed with fine artistic things?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-07-2009, 04:23 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

More. Obviously. There's so much more high quality work and so many more places to experience it.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-07-2009, 05:17 PM
GlennT's Avatar
GlennT GlennT is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,201
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

More volume, less substance. I think in a sound-bite driven media culture, a work can make a big temporal splash, but the attention is not held as long to really imbibe as deeply as in the past. It seems more about the story of the moment, and then on to the next thing.

That is a general cultural comment, but individuals are so different that it there may in fact be as many people capable and active in being deeply impressed by fine art today as in the past.

That is why I really appreciate works that have stood the test of time and are as inspiring today as they were hundreds or thousands of years ago. And with such works, you can appreciate the continuity of people responding to the work from inception in a specific cultural setting through the passage of time to today.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-07-2009, 06:17 PM
grommet grommet is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,275
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jOe~ View Post
More. Obviously. There's so much more high quality work and so many more places to experience it.
That isn't the question. It's about the capacity to be awed. Though jaded by watching TV that teaches you how to paint, sculpt, whatever, I think the gene pool and the capacity is about the same.
There is more knowledge spread around, but are you more awed because you understand more, or would you be awed anyway because you are predisposed to enjoy art?
__________________
Taking my own advice
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:14 PM
CritterSteve's Avatar
CritterSteve CritterSteve is offline
Level 4 user
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Santa Fe, NM
Posts: 73
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Maybe there's just so much more variety, and today a clever idea with out any need for executional skill ranks as highly as fine craftsmanship, so the amount of stuff to consider as fine art is so wide more people will find something they like.
In fact some fine art can make do with someone else's clever idea to describe it.
There weren't too many cd covers, funny or smart ads, conceptual installations, isms and underground posters kicking around in ancient times.
Since the net has widened to incorporate more stuff, more people presumably will like something in it.
A t-shirt, or sticker design perhaps?
Unless the fine art you are referring to excludes any more recent inclusions into the term.
How much stuff are we calling fine art?
Art seems undefinable, and fine seems equally subjective.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:15 PM
evaldart's Avatar
evaldart evaldart is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: easthampton, massachusetts
Posts: 5,630
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jOe~ View Post
More. Obviously. There's so much more high quality work and so many more places to experience it.
Exactly. Joe's short answer demonstrates an impressive restraint that says all that needs to be said. Despite all the eveidence pop culture feeds to us, people (more and more individuals) trudge forward. They will always realize to greater and greater degrees that what was once important just no longer is. They will be awed more and more by human efforts that refuse to "appeal". I could go-on of course...but I've already proven by my usual retorting that I'm not as smart as Joe.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-07-2009, 07:29 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
That isn't the question. It's about the capacity to be awed.
The "awed" was implied. Perhaps I shoudda writ: More(awed). Obviously. There's so much more high quality (awesome)work and so many more (awesome) places to experience(be awed by) it.

Quote:
I'm not as smart as Joe.
Bullshit. You, are, an awesome thinker and creator. Its just that my right jab might be faster and I don't hesitate to use it--but only in the furtherance of special causes.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-07-2009, 10:03 PM
grommet grommet is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,275
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jOe~ View Post
More. Obviously. There's so much more high quality work and so many more places to experience it.
This does not support what you are saying. If it's a supply and demand sort of thing there's some logic, but a pleasant activity does not constitute awe, only a recognized demand for diverse entertainment. Obviously. People have more time now to be bored. increased quantities of art and attendance to gawk do not indicate more awe or awsomeness, only more time and opportunity.
__________________
Taking my own advice
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-07-2009, 11:34 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
This does not support what you are saying.
What am I saying that does not support what I am saying--in such a simple , brief statement? Sheesh, you bored tonight?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-08-2009, 06:18 AM
grommet grommet is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,275
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Tired.
You say "more" and "Obviously".
Quote:
There's so much more high quality work and so many more places to experience it.
does not support "more".

If I strapped 50 or 1000 guys to their podiums and shipped them by flatbed railcar all around North America so that they could monologue to the world as they do in their back yards, the liklihood of someone experiencing awe at their presence only increases slightly for those who did not have the mental wanderings to be predisposed to being awed by guys on a soapbox (and do now). The rest that are awed are predisposed to be easily awed by manly blather-- no increase.

Quantity does not make something a treat if you didn't already like it to begin with.
Variety might diversify your sweet tooth, but can all still be broken down to the original sugar fix.
__________________
Taking my own advice
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:24 AM
evaldart's Avatar
evaldart evaldart is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: easthampton, massachusetts
Posts: 5,630
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

"Awe" is not something that can be supplied or demanded (or presented in a gallery or museum). And awe cannot be trumped-up by any blather (unless, of course, the blather itself is awesome). So, as awe inspiring Art goes, I DO suppose that MORE and MORE pertinently affecting aesthetic efforts are getting done...and this does have much to do with the fact that more and more individuals are aspiring to make Art. Of course most of them are NOT making Art, but thats another matter.

It actually has EVERYTHING to do with quantity because quality cannot be surmised as soon as more than one perception gets involved. It is the momentum of a conscioussness to wish to become absolved of the trivialities of function and swim in the maximally-yielding seas of Aesthetic oblivion. Huddling and gnawing amongst other like creatures will not ALWAYS be the way we prefer to pass the greater part of existence. The asides will become the drivers; short naps and and hearty snacks will suffice as respite and fuel.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:59 AM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

So Grommet and Glenn are shaking hands, nodding and saying, "Oh my, the state of art today. Tsk, tsk.". And I'm saying, "Dang even some of the crap I see is awesome!" No more can be said. Either you "see" it or you don't. Can't discuss personal art filters, that is never productive. For further explanation, see my comments(post #66, long version) in the "Iron clad definition of art" thread.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-08-2009, 08:26 AM
GlennT's Avatar
GlennT GlennT is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,201
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jOe~ View Post
So Grommet and Glenn are shaking hands, nodding and saying, "Oh my, the state of art today. Tsk, tsk.".
That's not at all what I'm saying. Oh, my, the state of jOe's mind today! Tsk,tsk!

My comment was directed at the flood of imagery, the media channels that form the way it is presented, and the effect of the public being overstimulated and how that affects perceptions of art.

As to the state of art today, there is so much going on at so many different levels, from the lows to the highs and lots of junk in the middle, that it is difficult to make a general statement about quality. There is probably more variety out there today than in any other period of recorded human history.

The fact that I hold a highly selective standard to what I personally appreciate most in art has little to do with the question originally posed by Glacierspirits.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-08-2009, 10:04 AM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
The fact that I hold a highly selective standard to what I personally appreciate most in art has little to do with the question originally posed....
True, too often.

Last edited by jOe~ : 05-08-2009 at 11:53 AM. Reason: humor
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-08-2009, 11:34 AM
StevenW's Avatar
StevenW StevenW is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Denver
Posts: 2,320
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacierspirits View Post
Would you say in today's world, the modern era, is more impressed with fine art, or less then in times from the past? I'm not talking sales volume, or public support, but rather the overall "ahhh" factor we all look for. Are people in general more, or less impressed with fine artistic things?

I think that people are less impressed with everything and not just Art, but the sense of wonder about our world and universe in general is largely missing in today's over-saturated, have anything you want now culture. The level of creativity to express the "new" is perhaps unreachable in this day and age and thus everything that is made, thought, expressed is little more than a variation of a re-run.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-08-2009, 01:41 PM
GlennT's Avatar
GlennT GlennT is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,201
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Of course, we're speaking from the perspective of affluent western societies. There are some corners of the globe, such as Manju's where things are a bit different.

And, thanks jOe for the encouragement!
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-08-2009, 07:51 PM
Thatch Thatch is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Dallas,Tx
Posts: 684
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

I may be wrong but there seem to be a lot more very large homes owned by people with large incomes. These homes tend to be decorated by the owners or by decorators. They use art. Probably not what people trained in Fine Art have, but some of it is pretty good. I have seen exactly the same print (signed and numbered) in Dallas and Las Vegas, but the homes were about the same size owned by people who are fairly well off. I don't think that the owners of either home bought them, I think they paid somebody to buy them.
I think there is more professionally made art out there than ever before. I don't mean repros either, though you can buy exellent copies these days.

Thatch
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-09-2009, 10:30 AM
Biomorph Biomorph is offline
ISC Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: new york city
Posts: 132
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

I'll read the consensus here as being that there are more people saying ahhh [NOT awe] to more art than ever. Proceeding from there, I think Glenn, at least on this issue, has his finger on the interesting question which is how is the perception of art affected by the flood of images, good, bad, better and worse and the attendant overstimulation of it all. Part of a very general problem in life today. How do you choose; indeed, how do you even know what to choose to look at from which to choose.
One partial solution is Glenn's: adopt a particular aesthetic and work with it. Of course, there is a question of how you choose it in the beginning and of how you should react to images outside of that sphere which you can't [and shouldn't] ignore. I think we'll see more and more thought being given to the issues of choice itself as the flood of possibilities rises.
I note that this Community has made choices. There is relatively little of, among other things, minimalist, conceptual or polemical art here or large, site specific assemblages or electronic art. We are basically traditional. It is this limitation that makes criticism and evaluation possible in these threads.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-09-2009, 11:01 AM
evaldart's Avatar
evaldart evaldart is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: easthampton, massachusetts
Posts: 5,630
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

"How do you know what to choose"


Simple. You trust a developed and ever developing sensibility. And we are speaking of THE sensibility that addresses aesthetics; the sensibility that identifies (out of the mash of charaders) pertinent and not useful pathways; the sensibility that fearlessly allocates propriety and strata, forsaking and embracing without tolerance. Thats all.

Last edited by evaldart : 05-09-2009 at 12:14 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-09-2009, 12:08 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
How do you choose; indeed, how do you even know what to choose to look at from which to choose.
I've never had that problem--can't imagine having it...lacking what Evaldart called " a developed and ever developing sensibility". That would be a hellish torment for me, being that confused. Seriously. How do you get by in a grocery store?

Quote:
There is relatively little of, among other things, minimalist, conceptual or polemical art here or large, site specific assemblages or electronic art. We are basically traditional.
All the really talented, edgy people post a few times and then leave. Why, because you are right. This forum is exceedingly conservative in all regards.

Quote:
It is this limitation that makes criticism and evaluation possible in these threads
"Criticism and evaluation possible"???? Is this something you learned in grad school?
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 05-09-2009, 12:18 PM
evaldart's Avatar
evaldart evaldart is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: easthampton, massachusetts
Posts: 5,630
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

"Talented" and "edgy" are words of inclusion not separation. They are the panderers to function and regularity. We've no need for them here. Worthy discourse arrives out of dissonance. Noise is better than melody.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-09-2009, 06:02 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
We've no need for them here.
Please explain before I slam the fucking door?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-09-2009, 07:33 PM
evaldart's Avatar
evaldart evaldart is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: easthampton, massachusetts
Posts: 5,630
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

In so many words, Joe, you proclaimed this "edge" and "talent" as two things that discerning artists posess...and that those discerning artists might have little patience for the discourse on this forum. Well screw em, I find that the blather here is extremely WIDE and that the work here (evidenced by the posting of images) is extremely WIDE.
You, Joe, need to explain the use of meaningless terms like "talent" and "edge". As an exceptionally informed proponent of the contemporary you must know that those things are irrelevent.
I would certainly say (and I've seen as much art as anyone) that most variations of real sculpture are represented here. And its okay if people think they cant bother with Art blather. Maybe they dont have time. But if you've conqured Time...and you're willing to exchange in quiet moments - great - or you could collect stamps.
And whats this "slamming the door" crap? Things must get discussed...we all havent yet gotten beyond that. one door slammed will only mean the opening of another...and as dialogue goes...good doors are hard to find.

So I explained...you still gonna slam the fucking door?

Last edited by evaldart : 05-09-2009 at 08:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-09-2009, 09:24 PM
jOe~'s Avatar
jOe~ jOe~ is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Spokane, Wa
Posts: 3,190
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

Quote:
those discerning artists might have little patience for the discourse on this forum. Well screw em, I find that the blather here is extremely WIDE and that the work here (evidenced by the posting of images) is extremely WIDE.
Well its like this. Whenever work gets posted here that I find extremely exciting,usually by first time posters, it gets poo pooed by traditionalists. These artists recognize there is no audience for them here and they leave. May not mean much to most folks here, but I miss many of them.

As far as the blather being "extremely WIDE" I find it narrow, very narrow.

As far as the work being "extremely WIDE", I disagree.

Again that is due to my bias. I love seeing things I've never seen the semblance of before. My comfort is not in tradition.

Quote:
this "edge" and "talent" as two things that discerning artists posess...
It is not common but when I see it I'm thrilled. Traditional work does not move me so much. Its like with music. I've got a large collection from opera and classical to extreme alternative. The newest stuff gets my feet moving. And surely you can't deny talent and edge in the music field? Bravado arguments fail here.

Quote:
And whats this "slamming the door" crap?
Get real tired talking to myself...pointless really, can't learn anything that way.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-09-2009, 10:38 PM
grommet grommet is offline
Level 10 user
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,275
Re: Today's society more or less impressed with fine art?

What I note usually is that when too many people disagree with Joe and the noggin thumping garners nothing, the hissy fit usually includes threats of leaving, like he has on occasion, with announcements each time. Whatever.

As to you being impressed with crap, you had the benefit of the whole experience whereas those after you just get crap, without the dog. It's like going to one of your concerts & arriving just in time to join the people leaving the concert.

Quote:
It actually has EVERYTHING to do with quantity because quality cannot be surmised as soon as more than one perception gets involved. It is the momentum of a conscioussness to wish to become absolved of the trivialities of function and swim in the maximally-yielding seas of Aesthetic oblivion. Huddling and gnawing amongst other like creatures will not ALWAYS be the way we prefer to pass the greater part of existence. The asides will become the drivers; short naps and and hearty snacks will suffice as respite and fuel.
Again, if you don't like the first one, you probably won't like the 20th one, unless a change is made. Quantity is not everything, it may be a singular piece that makes a connection. In which case a quest with a tuned head is all you need, not massive quantities of everything.
__________________
Taking my own advice
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Sculpture Community, Sculpture.net
International Sculpture Center, Sculpture.org
vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Russ RuBert