"Meaning" what does that mean?

[outsider]

Proving the point made earlier, is Mr. Evaldart.

[craigktx]

Originally Posted by evaldart

The problem with the spectacle of my particular process is that folks get caught up in the physical side. In fact, the things going on inside the walnut are indeed easily as laborious and risky.

The spectacle is what I seen, I the viewer am only entitled to the seeing.
Like you I work I the physical realm and it becomes all most impossible to impose a meaning to all viewers.
They see the force but little else, this plays out at the art shows when you
try to blather a meaning to the viewers and their gears stop spinning so I let them blather and listen to find a common meaning to continue the interaction.

If we played in the pre-loaded meanings then this wouldn't be as difficult.

Pre-loaded meanings, love (lust), hate, god, patriotism and landscape (etc).

Other pre-loads, piece that look alike in finish and content here these are shrimp boat/ bird painting.

[StevenW]

Well it is a good thing that the universe is packed full of matter so waste it I say. Waste, waste and more waste because the universe isn't using it and doesn't really care if you do either. If you actually believe in the fearmongering, self-aggrandizing nutters like Mr. Gore and think that every polar bear and sea lion (not to mention humanity itself) depends on the next time you choose to turn on a lightbulb or even build a nuclear reactor then you have no appreciation for scale. Going "green" is as ridiculous a religion (and notion) as any other.. Try harder..

[grommet]

still don't understand the necessity of calling names to make a point.

[underfoot]

Originally Posted by craigktx

and it becomes all most impossible to impose a meaning to all viewers.
.

nailed it Craig, it took many years for me to work this out.

~a conundrum~
I carve lots of figure studies/torso's etc,
they are the equivalent of life drawing sketches and have no meanings other than they are good practice and keep my eye in.
however, they are the currency I use to collect other artists (meaningfree) quick sketches, drawings and sculpts. I barter my meaningfree studies for theirs to decorate my nest. Cumulatively, they are a constant inspirational/motivational/ driving force.
they mean a great deal to me.

[rika]

Originally Posted by outsider

Thought + action = art

If thought equals meaning and action equals ego, then meaning+ego=art

[GlennT]

Originally Posted by evaldart

Glenn, Oscar stole your term "Age of Stupidity" a classic GlennT zinger. He cant do that. Intellectual property baby. I'd sue if I were you.

Perhaps, except I borrowed it from Dennis Prager. I hope he doesn't sue me.

[sculptor]

Originally Posted by StevenW

... the fearmongering, self-aggrandizing nutters like Mr. Gore ...

go for it
i'm always up for a good gore bashing
when he won the nobel prize
i lost all respect for the committee

6 mansions, a fleet of limousines, a 6 gallon per mile helacopter
a geewizz graph missing the first 90% and the bottom 80%
a personal fortune based on occidental petroleum
and a company that makes millions on carbon swaps

there is no name in my lexicon low enough to justify calling names for that
... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... thing

oh
wait a minute
"meaning".....
fuggetaboutit
or...
two paths diverged in a yellow wood... and eval took the one less traveled by
the meaning lies within
within the art
within the viewer
within the artist
oh---what a wondrous day when(the same) meaning is shared by all three
but
lets talk about what really matters

anyone had any really good out-of-body experiences lately?

[Ries]

In my sculpture, as in all things in my life, I try my best NOT to be mean.

But hey, if Meaning is so important, go ahead, knock yourself out, and Mean Away.

[evaldart]

Originally Posted by GlennT

Perhaps, except I borrowed it from Dennis Prager. I hope he doesn't sue me.

Awww, and all this time I've been telling everyone (because theres plenty of use for the term) it was a Glenn-ism. Oh, well, I never heard of this Prager guy...he must be an egghead or a guy with a TV show.

My favorite Sartre novel is "The Age of Reason" ( and you can imagine how ironic he's being). I really wanted it to be "Iron in the Soul", but I just couldn't get through that one. Scribblers. You CAN live without them (I think thats why Duchamp ended up a chess player).

[racine]

Originally Posted by evaldart

(I think thats why Duchamp ended up a chess player).

D got rheumatism from playing in the surf line... smart guy..

only answer comes to 'mind' is this sorta drawing, been in an idea book for years called '''meaning'''.. otherwise usually confused by the term.

[Zophia]

i think this fits better here...

well, every art community needs an "outsider" some one who can not find meaning in the abstract nature of sculpture. A sculpture can have very poingant meaning and still suck. What meaning is to one sculpture it is not to another.

I recently built a robot out of pipes, they critisized me for the shorts being too big and not enough figurative animation and blah blah blah. but what is funny was that they all failed to notice the real art i put into the heart. I took their perfuntory pieces and made them an animated robot sculpture but behind, inside all of that was this beautiful heart. I had the pieces first and made a sculpture out of them, There are kids that just walked by and understood that meaning, others who saw pictures understood it but no one here commented on it or seemed to understand the underlining message.

that is why my art is based on the imagination of a child, it is pure, unadulterated, true and can be both flattering and seemingly mean. In here you will get some perfuntory response to your hearts work. I guess we need that too, i like any critisism i get on my art but i don't agree to most of it. I trust a childs animation and this world of higher eschelon artists can have their opinions but they are mostly based on tenure and where your art is. The truth is beauty is beauty! It can be raw and disturbing or polished and soft... but what does it all mean..? I am not sure about all of it but for me the process has alot to do with it.

Z

[rika]

Zophia, you don't come here enough to realize that everyone who comments cares about your work and want you to get even better. Unfortunately you concentrate only on the negative and don't seem to notice the positive. I hope you don't think you're the only one who puts heart and soul into your work, we all do. It's ok to get emotional about criticism in the heat of the moment, but I hope you'll realize later that the things you say here are simply not true.

[jOe~]

Zophia, realize too, that no matter what you post here there will be those who will not like it, for real or imagined reasons. And they may love what you consider your weakest attempts. I've seen folks glow over potato shaped lumps of clay that are supposed to resemble bears or dogs or whatever. Its just weird how opinions manifest themselves. Typically, folks are so dear to their pontifications that its pointless to say anything contradictory, because of course, they are only trying to help you "grow". The works I've enjoyed the most have been so heavily criticized, even ridiculed, that the artists never returned(wise decision). I've posted comments similar to this many times.

[grommet]

Zophia, while I'm not one for icons & symbols, I did appreciate what you put into your sculpture. What I appreciated even more was what you captured of that experience in the photo i commented on. It caught more of your spirit than just the symbol. Put more of your personal fire into your work and don't rely on the "design" to say it all for you. You have a natural expression that doesn't have to be designed, it just comes out. This is guessing based on the video you had made. Do you venture much into expressive, undesigned work? i don't mean the assembled animals, i mean more "evaldart style".

[jOe~]

Do you venture much into expressive, undesigned work? i don't mean the assembled animals, i mean more "evaldart style".

Fuck "evaldart style".

Put more of your personal fire into your work and don't rely on the "design" to say it all for you.

Screw this bit of advice too.

This all refers to what I said in the previous post: "they are only trying to help you "grow"" As if they know what you need, where you've been and the direction you need to take, etc..Of course the"put more personal fire" comment was preceded by " I did appreciate what you put into your sculpture". They'll kill your own quest with kindness.

So Grommet, I haven't seen any of your "evaldart style" work. What b.s..

[grommet]

okay joe, you can just type out what I'm approved to think and I'll give you my password so you can cut out the middleman. work for you?

All I'm suggesting is there's more ART in her work than she's giving credit. That while she may think she put her heart into one part, it shows throughout, to just go with it.

But I can see why you'd wanna take a bit of my ass, it's a real peach.

[craigktx]

I do not post here for the praise, there is plenty found locally but putting
a heart into the Tin Man falls short on my list,make a Heart into a Tin Man
might spark more praise.

Thick skin is needed when you play here.
Do you get my meaning?

[jOe~]

what I'm approved to think

Approval has nuttin' to do with it. Different view on the matter. Glad you didn't get too rattled by my strong statement. Just shakin' the tree(peach) as usual.

[evaldart]

Zophia doesnt need US to grow. She's got a shop full of all the right gear, plenty of material laying around, and a very capable and fearless motivation. She's got everything she needs. She comes here for blather and some tech; like us all. So whether you get the F-bomb from Joe or the G-bomb from Glenn...you gotta take it without whining (counter-pointing, though, is quite encouraged).

But those little hearts that she cuts out and puts into things do not have a sculptural presence. Perhaps they are personally valuable to her as a SYMBOL. They are only little two-dimensional signatures, they (those valentine-ish cuties) do not interact with the masses, forms, contours and gestures that define a 3-D composition. The metaphorical "heart" is already inside of all good sculpture. THAT is the "heart" that gets noticed. Not the little flat thing.
So Z, fellow metal mangler, all the good stuff comes from the challenges and difficulties between you and your medium...the other stuff, the easy stuff, the fun stuff that you can do while smiling, is just seasoning...not meat.

[jOe~]

But those little hearts that she cuts out and puts into things do not have a sculptural presence. Perhaps they are personally valuable to her as a SYMBOL. They are only little two-dimensional signatures, they (those valentine-ish cuties) do not interact with the masses, forms, contours and gestures that define a 3-D composition. The metaphorical "heart" is already inside of all good sculpture. THAT is the "heart" that gets noticed. Not the little flat thing.

Maybe the "little flat thing" is meant to be seen as a tattoo? Then again if it was cut out of fat metal, say 3", it might have more pulse. Then yet again, maybe she's aiming for a different audience than you. I bet she is. I know she is. She doesn't weigh every damn thing she creates or lays her hands on like you. I mean, do you think I'm impressed by the weight of your sculptures Eval my man? Hell no. I LOOK at the work for a long time before I even remember to my obligation to you and put it on my visual scale. Why I bet you're probably setting prices by the pound, with commissions having a minimum tonnage.

[evaldart]

Joe, fact is ...if its flat its 2-d...sorry. Weight has nothing to do with it. And selling has nothing to do with Art either. So if you sell it by the pound or by the inch or by the frivolous determinations of some art-monger, to keep yourself sheltered and protiened...it couldnt matter less to the ART... Thats all ant stuff.

oh, and tattoos are just surface deco; like the swirlies on the stainless or the powdercoat, or the placard next to the art. Its never the Art.

[Zophia]

i do appreciate your opinions wether i like them or not. I have learned my truest way to judge the "success" of my art is through the eyes of a child. My goal is to bring back art to the people who may not be artists. People don't want some conceptual abstract stuff they want something real and strong and fun. As part of a public sculpture i am proposing i want to use old coal equipment and materials and make the sculpture out of that. No matter what i make the community is already associated with it. Being more organic and curvy i will probably do something growing or maybe a donkey (that may be too political), but yes that is what i want my art to be- a mirror to the community and world in which i live. I sell little flowers at these craft shows and it is so awesome when a child comes up and sniffs them or pets one of my little scrap animals or even plays with the chain beard of a hobbit scrap creature.

I guess when i was speaking of tenure and that crap i was kind of referring to the local sculpture dilema and the perfuntory responses of some members in this group. I can take the critisism and i hope you keep it coming. it is funny though i get more responses about my "crappy" art then the stuff i install that wins awards. by rappy i mean that i did it more on a whim than really put myself into it.

The sculpture here in Eastern Tennessee is wrought with politics and this weird concept that artists don't actually make their own work.(yeah please explain that one to me) Like the new sculpture that went in at UT. It is about a few people who thik thay should be in charge but are to lazy to do anything in return Knoxville's public art in pretty much not existant except for those paid for my corporations. It gets frustrating. Outsider kind of annoys me with his negativity but the fact is i do appreciate knowledgable opinions no matter what they are.

thank you for your time and responses i do appreciate them

Z

[Zophia]

this is the shit that annoys me...

I went to the lecture that when this artist finalized her idea. I looked at the sculpture and wondered "how" could it be done. I like the proposed design but didn;t see how it would work unless she used 4 inch think aluminum to support it. When i asked this question the room just kind of looked at me weird. Someone whispered that she would have someone fabricate it. Ok but still how could it be done? the group obviously had no technical knowledge. well here is the finished sculpture

http://www.utk.edu/tntoday/2009/09/0...ication-event/

which it SO different from the one proposed. see the static poles holding up the aluminum swirl... these were not in the origional design and totally change the feeling of it. So how does someone so removed from her medium get a half a mil to have someone do this and not even understand the engineering of her design or the limits of her material???? but for the artists sake i did like the origional design.

[sparrow]

What does "Beauty" mean? Is it only in the eye of the beholder or can you actually create it?