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  #1  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:01 AM
grommet grommet is offline
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Damien Hirst auction

one of many stories
Hirst bypasses galleries and auctions original works with Sotheby's. Today is the second day of the auction. Should we pool our pennies?
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  #2  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:17 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

I love it! I hope the value of his legacy become incalculable. Perhaps that is his conceptual goal.

As far as pitching in to buy something - count me in.

*digs through pockets*

I have 34 cents in mixed coinage (mostly US), a bit of brightly colored fluff, what used to be a tissue and a small Lego (but it is a three-er - so that is probably worth a bit).
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  #3  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:21 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Poor Hirst, he may well be remembered by some of the ants but he cannot find himself within the history of his own mind...let that be a lesson to us all.
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  #4  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:23 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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Originally Posted by evaldart View Post
Poor Hirst, he may well be remembered by some of the ants but he cannot find himself within the history of his own mind...let that be a lesson to us all.
Is the lesson not to hit the sauce so early in the morning? Ants? History of his own mind? Wha???
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  #5  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:30 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

do you think he really needs thoughs really cool art glasses or are they part of the costume
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  #6  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:40 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

It is possibly one of the most self-inhibiting and self destructive acts an artist can commit to pander to the curiosities of culture. There is great misfortune...tragedy even, present in "contemporary" art whereby the doing individual thinks he is spearheading when he is actually in the back...sad baggage. Pitifully gullible, duped by his own culture. Masses, though, like their baggage - and like it better when its fancy - and have been known to treat it quite well. The moral of the story: carry yourself away.

Chris, they're saftey glasses...he's got money flying around him all over the place...wouldn't want to catch a thousand dollar bill in the eye.
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  #7  
Old 09-16-2008, 10:53 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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It is possibly one of the most self-inhibiting and self destructive acts an artist can commit to pander to the curiosities of culture.
Like the cave painters of early nomadic culture, the Greeks, the Romans, and all those Renaissance hacks (among many others).

Sorry Eval, from my vantage exploring the "curiosities of culture" is the point of the visual arts - all else is regurgitation or masturbation (or a sticky, messy combo of the two).
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  #8  
Old 09-16-2008, 11:29 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

will these guys really go down in the art history books with Rodin Picasso Michelangelo and others or 500 or 600 years from know will they be in other history books with pam anderson and paris hilton and captain kerk
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  #9  
Old 09-16-2008, 11:35 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Cheese, The reason-for-Art has grown alongside the very special consciousness of mankind...consistently from the cave through antiquity and up into our time. ALWAYS changing. All along Art alone has ushered-in the progress - NOT culture. Culture is and has always been a symptom of dependence in the human experience. As we move so slowly in the right direction - the ART will change us into the things we should be...Not the buildings, pass-times and technologies. There is evolutionary momentum to the changes in what is and is-not regarded as Art - and it will be the exceptional (perceived possibly as the mutated) that will indulge in the most pertinent satisfactions. But it will require a leap of will and a pursuit of uncharted detachment. It is a culminating case of great masses of humanity unknowingly succumbing to a rare few.

Nice metaphor with the sperm and puke....(sigh), culture.
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  #10  
Old 09-16-2008, 11:43 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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will these guys really go down in the art history books with Rodin Picasso Michelangelo and others or 500 or 600 years from know will they be in other history books with pam anderson and paris hilton and captain kerk
Like Capt.Kirk - Rodin, Picasso, Michelangelo are all products of a peculiar construct called Art History. To some degree they are equally fictional (of course more recent artists like Picasso are better documented and therefore less a product of wishful or romantic embellishment).

Like Hirst - Rodin, Picasso, Michelangelo were notable artists in their day - celebs of a measure.

Is it the artist or the work that warrants inclusion into the hallowed pages of art history? Talent or the size of the patron's wallet? Is it wrong to measure an artist's success by sales and "buzz"? I'm not so sure.
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  #11  
Old 09-16-2008, 11:49 AM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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Originally Posted by evaldart View Post
Cheese, The reason-for-Art has grown alongside the very special consciousness of mankind...consistently from the cave through antiquity and up into our time. ALWAYS changing. All along Art alone has ushered-in the progress - NOT culture. Culture is and has always been a symptom of dependence in the human experience. As we move so slowly in the right direction - the ART will change us into the things we should be...Not the buildings, pass-times and technologies. There is evolutionary momentum to the changes in what is and is-not regarded as Art - and it will be the exceptional (perceived possibly as the mutated) that will indulge in the most pertinent satisfactions. But it will require a leap of will and a pursuit of uncharted detachment. It is a culminating case of great masses of humanity unknowingly succumbing to a rare few.

Nice metaphor with the sperm and puke....(sigh), culture.
Hey! I've seen that episode. You know - the one where we become beings of pure energy. Life....but not was we know it. Beam me up, Eval!

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All along Art alone has ushered-in the progress - NOT culture.
Can you help me with this quote? What is this separation between progress and culture? Perhaps we are simply using these words in (very) different ways.
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  #12  
Old 09-16-2008, 12:01 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Sci-fi is just more culture. Fun indeed.

The problem with getting answers is that they depend upon communication methodologies - which will fizzle-out eventually.

Ball of energy, Hah, enlightened humans will always make vital use of their arms and legs (and they could still be balls of energy)...but if you see an artist that is NOT using them as he should ...well, that says something.
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  #13  
Old 09-16-2008, 01:14 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

What Hirst is doing is as old as the hills.
It's called: Hucksterism. Kind of like the traveling snake oil charlatans of yore. Cut out the apothecary, sell directly to the gullible rubes.

Since he doesn't make art but a commodity,
I'm surprised his stuff isn't trading on the mercantile exchange. Or is it?
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  #14  
Old 09-16-2008, 02:28 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Call me weak, call me a whore, call me whatever. I don't have that many years left on this planet and I wouldn't trade 100 million for a penniless place in art history. However if I did get that kind of dough I bet I'd get at least a foot note in the art of making money. Good enuff.
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  #15  
Old 09-16-2008, 02:47 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

[quote=jOe~;65304]Call me weak, call me a whore, call me whatever. I don't have that many years left on this planet and I wouldn't trade 100 million for a penniless place in art history. However if I did get that kind of dough I bet I'd get at least a foot note in the art of making money. Good enuff.[/QUOT

There are episodes of intensity that can outlast eternity. And, "dead" and "dread" are the same word (stupid humans can't spell). legacies and footnotes are just predicted memories...the intended desire to be remebered nullifies the acts it took to get there. So there is no need to aspire to remembrence or a color-plate in the Jannsens ever-revised phone-book (Art Through the Ages).

As money goes - we will ALL, unfortunately, have to have some. So remember to pick some up every now and then.

Last edited by evaldart : 09-16-2008 at 03:19 PM.
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  #16  
Old 09-16-2008, 03:33 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Translation/reconfiguration of what e-dart just said:

What a suprise it will be when some folks discover that their soul did not die, just a worn out body, and their consciousness is still there left holding the bag of a legacy of vapid works traded for a mess of potage and a passing glimmer of recognition.

How much better to have sincerely done the best one could do with what they were given to work with, and a life lived honorably.
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  #17  
Old 09-16-2008, 05:09 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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Originally Posted by evaldart View Post
Sci-fi is just more culture. Fun indeed.
Right...perhaps...but they haven't yet. (I noticed you are still using words made strung together to convey ideas - even if said ideas are complex or confusing.)

How do you separate yourself from "culture" or cultural references? Is it possible in the here and now? Is it really something that you honestly aspire to or are you just projecting an assumed and inevitable transformation of “spirit”?

More importantly, if none of us are yet able to distance ourselves from our own cultures - why use the rejection of cultural references as a qualifier for judging Hirst?
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  #18  
Old 09-16-2008, 05:38 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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Originally Posted by Tlouis View Post
What Hirst is doing is as old as the hills.
It's called: Hucksterism. Kind of like the traveling snake oil charlatans of yore. Cut out the apothecary, sell directly to the gullible rubes.

Since he doesn't make art but a commodity,
I'm surprised his stuff isn't trading on the mercantile exchange. Or is it?
Does his financial success automatically make him a "huckster"? Why?

I think his work is just beautiful. I don't give a flip how many hands are involved in producing the work, how easy or hard it is to make, what it is valued at, how much Hirst profits, or how it is situated (or validated) by historians and critics. I am transported by his work and always impressed when I meet one face to face.

Are you reading the "labels" or looking at the work? Like it or don't like it - but it seems pretty narrow to dismiss an artist (or accuse them of being dishonest) simply for being successful. No?
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  #19  
Old 09-16-2008, 06:21 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

[quote=cheesepaws;65316][quote=evaldart;65296]Sci-fi is just more culture. Fun indeed.
Quote:

Right...perhaps...but they haven't yet. (I noticed you are still using words made strung together to convey ideas - even if said ideas are complex or confusing.)

How do you separate yourself from "culture" or cultural references? Is it possible in the here and now? Is it really something that you honestly aspire to or are you just projecting an assumed and inevitable transformation of “spirit”?

More importantly, if none of us are yet able to distance ourselves from our own cultures - why use the rejection of cultural references as a qualifier for judging Hirst?
Without "society", "community" and, as it it observed-upon, "culture", mankind, as we yet know it, is nothing but lion food. But our growing tendencies to pursue leisure and entertainment and spectacle (beyond just pleasure) betray a deviance within the individual for control over his WANTS as opposed to his NEEDS. It is possible to separate yourself from "culture" because your home and your job are not necessarily "places". You leave your culture during the instances that you do not give or take from them. You are in YOUR place when your doings have become isolated along with you in an instance of self-determination. Though your matter (material) may still posess the imprint of a "culture", and they love to claim it, you are secretly able to change and assemble and re-context it by creativity (NOT invention) and realize a growing, fruitful bewilderment.

The trifling rewards and perceived affluences achieved by Hirst and his ilk are only holding Art (and human development) back. Amid such weighty distraction I would be surprised if he could ever recover. But an human individual is never lost, by the virtue of his elevated awarenesses, so he might yet find some pertinence...but if so, he'll see it for himself in the mirror without the glasses on.

You see, Cheese, the asking of questions and the seeking of answers is a desperate act...leaves us hapless and victimized (upon close inspection). And solutions will only attempt to end our inquiries...or crush our wonder. It is not a TRANSFORMATION we Artists must be seeking, it is not a desire to nurture a "spirit" or any other meatless entity. We have the ability reach out at arms length, take whatever is there and "model" it into submission. Its all there - all the information, junk, Mona Lisas, thingamabobs, Super Bowls, and brouhahas - to SERVE us...not the other way around. And by us doing-so some poor sap might get a shot at it himself. But that is no concern of ours.

Last edited by evaldart : 09-16-2008 at 06:57 PM.
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  #20  
Old 09-16-2008, 07:25 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Hirst is a Jack As.

Yeah remember the 50 mill. or what ever he said the skull went for. It was all bull. It was Hirst's money (or was it called a loan) just to jack up the headline price. I wouldn't be surprised if he or his boys bought most everything there. Sotheby's - they've certainly proved themselves readily available for price fixing.
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:56 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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Hirst is a Jack As.

Yeah remember the 50 mill. or what ever he said the skull went for. It was all bull. It was Hirst's money (or was it called a loan) just to jack up the headline price. I wouldn't be surprised if he or his boys bought most everything there. Sotheby's - they've certainly proved themselves readily available for price fixing.
Whatever. You might have well simply said you think he is a scam artist because of the brand of smokes he prefers, his nationality or his height.

I just don't get slandering someone based on a perceived (mostly assumed) measure of financial success.

Do you like the work? Why - why not?
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  #22  
Old 09-16-2008, 08:39 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

so grommet where are you seems you dropped this one like a hot potatoe and ran. i guess your pretty busy with the steaming heap thread though
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Old 09-16-2008, 09:12 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

Quote:
Do you like the work? Why - why not?
I like it because I'm an art whore. I'm easy. And I don't believe in abstinence. I think the money part of it is significant too.I don't have time to give a more intelligent answer.
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  #24  
Old 09-16-2008, 09:17 PM
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

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a more intelligent answer.
hell i couldnt even spell captain kerk right
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  #25  
Old 09-16-2008, 10:32 PM
grommet grommet is offline
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Re: Damien Hirst auction

I can appreciate his thinking outside the box approach, much like the fun guy at the party that has all the bizarre ideas. But he (Hirst) actually does them (well, not actually, because other people do his work)... and perhaps that takes even more balls, so people gotta watch. They admire his audacity, and hold it up and aspire to have it. but the best they can do to show their audacity is to buy some of his. Tell your partner what you just bought for how many ever million-- that takes balls... Or perhaps the whole sale was another one of his pieces. His life is one continuing prank.
Living the life...
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