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Old 09-26-2007, 12:55 PM
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Re: Cultural Gothic- Paul McCarthy

Originally Posted by GlennT
Interesting, though, to juxtapose the million year old survival needs and instinct of meat eating with the fabricated desire to bugger animals.
People don't NEED meat, it is a luxury, and one in fact that wastes huge amounts of resources and creates enormous amounts of pollution. It's conversion loss is if I remember from a discussion elsewhere earlier this summer- 9 pounds of grain, corn etc to make ONE pound of beef, I forget how many thousands of gallons of already short water it takes, and how much pollution from factory farm runoff winds up in rivers, streams, lakes and ground water.
MOST of the corn grown in this country is instead fed to LIVESTOCK at that conversion loss. Corn that could otherwise feed people is squandered stuffing cattle in huge numbers so people who prefer to eat meat can.

with the fabricated desire to bugger animals.
Everything we do except eat sleep and breath is fabricated desire, including masturbation, sex, entertainment, arts, music, going for a drive to see the fall leaves etc.
Relationships with animals, at least pets- is a symbiotic one, both the person and the animal usually gain something, the animal gets care, food, water, medical , affection and so on, the person gets a companion, pet, affection etc. In some cases it goes deeper, but is a continuation of the affection portion of the relationship.

In the animal kingdom, meat eating is a part of the natural order. I'm unfamiliar with interspecies animal sex being part of the natural order.
It is, because animals can't cook food or grow corn, however, they DO have not only a sex drive but the same body parts people do and the same physiological responses, including a clitorus and orgasm. There are quite a few inter-species photos on the web and plenty of evidence of homosexual acts as well. The USDA did a study on so called "gay rams" and found their brains had a difference, the study was done because farmers were complaining about buying expensive breeding rams only to find they preferred to try breeding other rams and had no interest in the Ewes.

Domestic pets don't generally care WHAT they mate with, especially in the case of male dogs- the sofa cushions or your leg works just as well.

Why bother looking to natural cycles for answers though, if we are not willing to see global warming as a cyclical pattern that has occurred long in Earth's history, and prefer to use it as a prop to push a social agenda?
Seriously- yes there's natural cycles, but none as fast and extensive as THIS one, the ice core samples show the chemistry of the ice and how it's drastically changed since the industrial revolution in the 19th century. When there was only a million people on the entire planet these cycles didn't matter much, neither did volcanoes or meterorite strikes, but now with every acre of land covered by humans or developed in some way, and the dwindling resources- one bad event or a couple of bad crop years, a flood like N.O. and it's a major disaster.
Before 1492 if N.O. was hit by a hurricane and flooded ten feet deep, it didn't matter- no one lived there, ditto for the volcano in Oregon's Crater Lake area, or the volcano near Seattle when it blew up and there was a huge quake, it didn't matter, now thousands of people can be killed if not more, and billions of dollars in damages.
By the way, the bit about blaming the children or parents for accessing destructive elements in our culture is weird.
How is that "wierd"? parents taking responsibility for themselves and their kids, and setting their own criteria for what is acceptable to them?

What someone may consider "destructive" is only their opinion, it is not factual unless a negative can be proven is the direct result.
We know cigarette smoking causes cancer, so smoking is destructive, but that is the smoker's choice not mine to make FOR them.

We know too much alcohol is destructive, it's proven every day, small
amounts are not, but there are already laws against getting drunk and behind the wheel of a car, prohibition didn't work, it was a failure and simply created criminals and a massive black market with the mobsters raking in fortunes, ditto for gambling now you have casinos in Nevada and elsewhere.
The list goes on.
Someone who has sex with an animal in private harms no one, it affects no one and given the fact this pornography is extremely popular indicates there is a significant as well as growing market for both. The 15% of people in that above survey of 7,000 also shows it.
You do a simple Google search for three search words, here is the result in numerical order;

Results 1 - 100 of about 1,160,000 for heterosexuality
Results 1 - 100 of about 3,500,000 for bestiality
Results 1 - 100 of about 13,800,000 for homosexuality

If there was little or no interest in this, you would not find three and half MILLION hits for it in Google.

Like they say, no one is going to look after you but YOU, you are the most important person to YOU, the guy 2 miles down the road is probably not going to care much as he is looking out for himself and has his own problems.
Is it alright for factories to pollute rivers as long as they post signs that say, warning, do not drink out of this body of water?
That is apples and oranges and does not apply the same to the subject at hand- people do not NEED to go surfing the web or to seek out pornography or nude art, they choose to. Last time I checked it's illegal to walk nude on public streets as well as perform ANY sex acts on a public street or park- people walking to work don't have a choice not to in order to avoid a nude sex show on the street, so it's not allowed, you do have a choice what you do on the web.

Pollution affects everyone very negatively, but aside from that- EVERYONE pollutes, so everyone is contributing to that regardless, it's degree is the only difference.
Unless you live in a rock cave and forage for mushrooms, chances are you live in a heated/A/C wood house with a paved driveway, a car, appliances that use electric, water, sewage and pollute the air.