Foundries -- China, India, or such.

[ESBUF]

Hi. Happy new year. I. just want to introduce myself -- Erskine Bufano. I'm the son of a sculptor, Beniamino Bufano. He worked in New York, San Francisco, Paris, and Italy from 1900-1970. I have a model of a small St. Francis statue of his that I would like to reproduce for a fundraiser in tribute to him. The statue is 11 inches in height and very simple, with no undercuts. I want it reproduced in bronze, in an edition of about 25,000. I'm looking for a foundry in China, India, or the like, that does excellent work, inexpensively. If you could e-mail me the e-mail addresses or phone numbers of foundries, I would certainly appreciated. Can anyone help me? Please contact me at esbuf@yahoo.com.
Thank you in advance.
Erskine Bufano

[Merlion]

I have recently posted some information on bronze art foundries in Thailand in this Forum, including the website addresses of five of them there. I have experience with only one of them, Patima Bronze.

You'll find these information in the Thread 'Bronze Foundry in Thailand' of the Forum 'Construction Techniques and Processes'. If you have problem finding this Thread, just click here (http://www.sculpture.net/community/showthread.php?t=1988).

[Landseer]

I have recently posted some information on bronze art foundries in Thailand in this Forum, including the website addresses of five of them there. I have experience with only one of them, Patima Bronze.

You'll find these information in the Thread 'Bronze Foundry in Thailand' of the Forum 'Construction Techniques and Processes'. If you have problem finding this Thread, just click here (http://www.sculpture.net/community/showthread.php?t=1988). Pretty nice, Patima has what looks like a stock selection of pieces for sale too. I really like some of their life sized animals;

Lion attacking snake
Horse carriage life size with base
Bull (life size)

http://www.patimabronze.com/animal2.htm

They look very well done, but no prices are shown, wonder what they go for!
Bet the shipping would be horrid, if I had a few spare dollars I'd buy the "Horse carriage life size with base"

[Merlion]

They look very well done, but no prices are shown, wonder what they go for!
Bet the shipping would be horrid, if I had a few spare dollars I'd buy the "Horse carriage life size with base"

When I was there, they were putting patina on the 'Eagle on Tree (Large)' bronze sculpture. The eagle is quite well sculpted and I quite like it. I asked the price and they mentioned US$1500 excluding shipping. This is more or less life size and the sculpture is 1.7 m (66 in) tall. (Correction: I read the website wrongly, it is 2.13 m or 7.0 ft tall, to the wing tips).

I wouldn't know what is the shipping cost to US east coast. I think they'll be glad to quote if you ask them by email. Shipping cost to Singapore is not much though.

[Landseer]

Wow, that's a good price! that piece is pretty complicated, so maybe the others are not far off that price. The shipping is the issue, I know it cost a customer of mine $45 for parcel post for a sculpture to Japan that only weighed 12-14#

I've bought a few things from the UK and the shipping was horrendous, it wouldn't surprise me if the shipping was $1500, but maybe strapped to a pallet it would be less.
I found this just looking as I know a lot of freight is containerized and shipped via sea;

"The charge for a 20-foot container on American routes is now between $1,700 and $1,800, according to the Thai National Shippers' Council."

[Merlion]

My guess is that except for the very small ones, they are packed into wooden crates and shipped together with other crates in shipping containers.

Back to bronze art foundries in China, I know there are many and they can cast bigger sculptures than the Thai ones. But apparently they still do not have good English websites. From Google searches, I have so far found only one, it is Nanjing Bronze (http://www.njbronze.com/index.html).

[Landseer]

My guess is that except for the very small ones, they are packed into wooden crates and shipped together with other crates in shipping containers.

I would imagine that would be the case, still, once the crate gets to the US docks ithas to be handled again on a truck or rail, they add in their charges for weight and distance, and then delivery from there can be done to the trucking terminal or locally, if locally to a residential they usually charge another $100 or so because there wouldn't be a loading dock.

I had a heavy concrete mixer delivered at work on a pallet for $40 from Grizzly industrial, they must have had a special rate because a 300# sculpture shipped here from Pennsylvania was over $250 for the trucking about 6 years ago.
So I'm guessing trucking a heavy crate from the East coast to here might run $400-$500, probably more since that horse would be a big crate. Another one they have on that site it says is 900#- a bit larger but not a lot- both are forklift material :)

But anyway, never know what might happen, so I bookmarked the site.

[bluedogshuz]

Merlion,
Did you have your piece cast in Thialand? The casting cost in US are unaffordable. I was thinking of having minature additions of work, say under 50lbs., I wonder if that could be shipped more affordable by air. I do have some experience with partial containers, pallets etc. from Italy, what a big expense and hassle! Wonderin your thoughts?

[Merlion]

I think you are right Bluedogshuz that it is better to 'ship' smaller items by air. But I suppose foundries in Asia familiar with export to other countries would be familiar with arranging both air and sea shipping.

My experience is very limited as this is the first time I am doing it.

My own bronze castings are now being shipped together with my sculptor friend's bigger items to the Singapore port. And my friend has already arranged for a local transport company to do port clearance and to deliver the items by road to where she wants it. It is an art exhibition site as she is having a solo sculpture exhibition there soon.

Anyway, it would be useful to get others here to share their experience.

Fused has mentioned he knows a friend who for 10 years have been having his bronze castings done in India. And Paul Dipasquale (who only posted twice) mentioned he casted his huge bronze sculpture Virginia Beach Neptune in Ningbo, China, and he seems to be happy with their work. You can do a search for their postings.

[Landseer]

The prices are certainly reasonable. Shipping is a different issue. Prices seem real good, but if the shipping winds up costing as much or more than the bronze then on some pieces it could potentially cost more than having them cast "locally."
This might be especially true of smaller pieces but I could be wrong.

I'd sure like one of those life sized carriage horses on that one foundry site and would look into one if I have good sales this year and so on, but doing a little looking at shipping costs a 20' container might run $1800 +- but as was pointed out in a way here, it's possible I think such a container or a 40' container already scheduled to ship would have goods from several sources filling it, each sharing the cost proportionally.
If that was the case the cost might almost be less for that leg of the trip than trucking from the East coast to here.

If that horse was around the same cost as that complicated eagle near the same size and the shipping was around $1000 I could probably spring for one if the total cost was up to $3000 but not if it was MUCH above that, gets hard to justify the expendature.
They only provide one photo on their web site, someone here I think was planning a trip there? maybe some photos planned on the trip?

Converting the measurements it's about 8 feet long 7-1/2 feet tall and about 2-1/2 feet wide, that would make a BIG crate!




The bronze in question;

[Merlion]

If that horse was around the same cost as that complicated eagle near the same size and the shipping was around $1000 I could probably spring for one if the total cost was up to $3000 but not if it was MUCH above that, gets hard to justify the expendature.
They only provide one photo on their web site, someone here I think was planning a trip there? maybe some photos planned on the trip?


Hi Landseer, their website has their email address. With no personal vested interest, let me say that for a genuine enquiry, they probably would not mind and may welcome taking more photos of it to send you, and to give you a quote on the horse's price and the cost of shipping to your nearest port.

[bluedogshuz]

I don't mean to disparage whole countries her but, I have see and stupidly bought commercial products cast in India and China that were an absolute joke, pot metal etc. I would try Thiland on a small piece say 10" maquette just to see what they can do. Shipping is part of doing business and like I said the locals US are very expensive, often you are shipping 1000 miles anyway.
As for containers, they are very large and often are divided up. The foundry would buy a volume and pass to you. I have not done it in years but when they reach the docks you have to get on it because you are dealing with heartless expiditers or what ever you call them. I know I paid brokers at the dock and to get trucking arranged etc. I would definitly work a small piece and try to avoid the latter. Gotta inquire and take some chances if your gonna know.....

[Landseer]

Hi Landseer, their website has their email address. With no personal vested interest, let me say that for a genuine enquiry, they probably would not mind and may welcome taking more photos of it to send you, and to give you a quote on the horse's price and the cost of shipping to your nearest port.
Hi Merlion,
Yes, that is true and I will look into doing that and see where I stand later in the year. Hours are being cut back at work now till they figure April or May and that's $100 a week hit.

[bluedogshuz]

Merlion
Thanks for the thread to Patima bronze. I e mailed an image with size req. Hoping they cangive me an estimate. Please let us know how your experience is with them. Pat

[Landseer]

Off on a tangent :)

One of my dog bronzes from 1993, about 8" tall pictured

I've had in mind for a number of years to do a horse model and lately I've been thinking about the idea again, and why the heck not? If I can do the dogs, a manatee and polarbear I certainly ought to be able to do a horse model if I get motivated enough later this year. Lifesized is just too big and too expensive a project, but maybe 1/4 or about 2 feet tall would fit my work space and other factors.
For the dogs I used plasticene and the only armature I used for support was a threaded vertical rod, so I guess the questions I have on doing something 2 feet tall standing on 2 or 4 legs would be on armature construction and the clay. Do most of you working in that size create a sort of open mesh around the armature to apply the clay to it hollow, or do you just build the thing up totally solid on a rod or pipe armature?

Most of you would use water clay not plasticene right?

I thought that since there is a horse club here, that I could find someone nearby who might pose a horse in the field and let me take a bunch of digital photos and some reference measurements, then I'd have something to work from.

[Landseer]

Merlion, and others interested in the Thailand foundry issues, a total coincidence the other day happened, I did a search on Ebay for "Patima" and amazingly enough a bronze came up in the search for sale there.

Even more amazing is the bronze for sale is the same model as that lifesized bronze horse!
Apparantly Patima once produced a table sized version of this, which is not shown on their web site and I assume might have been discontinued.
From the seller's description it says:

THIS BRONZE HORSE STANDS SOME 19" TALL AND SOME 21.5" LONG FROM NOSE TO END OF TAIL. HE IS MOUNTED ON A MARBLE BASE WHICH MEASURES SOME 14.7"LONG. THIS IS A VERY HEAVY BRONZE WEIGHING OVER 12KG. BASE IS IMPRESSED "MENE". THERE IS ALSO AN IMPRESSED FOUNDRY MARK. (Patima)

So now I know that the original artist for this design in some size or form was Mene, though of course this is a reproduction not an original and that goes without saying.

I wonder what size Mene made this in originally, maybe that lifesized one was the original size.

In any case as the auction was ending while I was at work, I used an auction snipe service to place my bid in the last 7 seconds so a bid war wouldn't jump the cost up.
With almost 200 views I didn't think I would win, but I did for £155- about $274 US dollars which I am quite happy with and I had bid a max of £205 figuring if it went for more than that I could probably get a new one from Patima directly.
This one is a number of years old and had been stored in a shed. As Patima is only 45 years old and this bronze does have their foundry mark clearly impressed on it, it is likely between 20 and 45 years old.
It weighs about 25-30# so it should be fairly substantially made.

Here are some photos of it so you can see some of their smaller work and detailing, I'll take some of my own when it arrives.
The postage cost isn't too terrible, £50 as this is in the UK and the size/weight...

I think it was nicely done and is a very nice size, the patina looks to be a nice red/brown, I'm not sure I really care for the "highlighting" that was done on some of the details but we'll see when it arrives.


The pose is slightly different from the lifesized edition if you'll notice.

[iron ant]

Erskine,If you are in CAli,have you though about Mexican Foundries?The cost on shipping alone makes it worth looking into,but I am out of the foundry loop,just a sujestion.It is ashame you can not do it in the states,like a good start up foundry that needs work and will work with your budget.Good luck...IA

[Merlion]

Erskine,If you are in CAli,have you though about Mexican Foundries?

I did a quick Google search for bronze art foundries in Mexico, and have found two. One is called Art21Studio (http://www.art21studio.com/icontenido.html), the other Art Foundry (http://www.laneta.apc.org/foundry/bronce.htm). If one takes more time, one should be able to find more. Good luck.

[Merlion]

Paul Dipasquale (who only posted twice) mentioned he casted his huge bronze sculpture Virginia Beach Neptune in Ningbo, China, and he seems to be happy with their work. You can do a search for their postings.

I can now come back to this, about bronze art foundries in China. It took me some persistent efforts to find the websites of such foundries. I understand they have many. So far I have managed to find six.

Four have websites in English.
Foshan Mingu (http://www.ming-gu.com/doce/sample1.htm) in S China not too far from Hong Kong, email (mgu@ming-gu.com).
Wuhan Wenxing (http://www.whwxzz.com/doce/home2_2.htm) at Wuhan in central China, email (whwx01@whwxzz.com).
Nanjing Bronze (http://www.njbronze.com/index.html), at Nanjing in central China, email (sales@njbronze.com).
Shanxi Yuda (http://www.sxyuda.com/english1.htm) in N China, not too far from Beijing, email (yuda@sxyuda.com).

For these other two, I can only find these websites in Chinese, but you can still see their sculptures and they can probably respond to English emails.
Beijing QTDS (http://www.bjqtds.com/chan.htm) at Beijing (or Peking), email (bjqtds@126.com).
Lingnam (http://www.gdhaijing.com/produce1.htm) in S China also not too far from Hong Kong.

I'm afraid I'm not successful so far in finding the website, if any, of the Ningbo foundry used by Paul Dispasquale.

By the way, Paul's postings are found in this thread (http://www.sculpture.net/community/showthread.php?p=15987#post15987) he started. There are stunning photographs there, as well as the Virginia Beach website.