kicking tires

[pinballannie]

Hi all,
Been nosing around in this here joint and I like it! I was researching MFA programs in sculpture but this seems like the kind of information I'm really looking for...context, really.

I'm a sculptor in Seattle, been out of school a while and am working at a small, great non-profit, casting bronze in a foundry and a jewelry context, and glass, kiln-cast. Dabble in other things.

Wanting to get an MFA but wary of the academic approach due to the experiences of friends in big univeristy programs, feeling wildly insecure about what it is that I do, long out of school and casting eccentric objects with little context/critique. Mostly pods/seeds in multiples, as burnout one-offs. Smallish (I take the bus--funny but true).

Would love dialogue...see what you all are up to and where this obsession with metal might take me. Also looking for more information about metallurgy...been looking for books and not finding much. Wanting to understand the structures in the metal.

I'll be back! This is great!

[TMR]

G'day pinballannie and welcome from a fellow newbie here....

Well it sounds as if you have great access to making already? bronze foundary access, lucky chap i'd say :D
As an aussie, no idea about MFA programs, but ouch on the academic approach, it seems here in Aus, all the schools are heading that way, students leaving with heads full of ideas/theories and no skills based training to speak of, concept concept and more of the same....
Am I to harsh...perhaps:)

As to metallurgy, being a hammer and tongs sort of fellow, I'm no help there, though I'm sure there's more than a few here with that knowledge, which I'm interested in as well.

Bus is calling me, ciao 4 now,
Tim

[sculptorsam]

Welcome, pinballannie. It sounds to me like you're doing the necessary foundation building that will no doubt pay off in the future. I've no experience with MFAs either. Didn't even manage a BFA. But luckily, the degree is not necessary to achieve ART. Why not post some pics for us to see? I use a lot of seed/modular forms in my work as well and you've peaked my curiosity.

[JAZ]

Dear Anne,
Like Tim, I'm jealous of your foundry access. As far as schools go... I have a BFA from the School of the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston. There the "structure" is pretty open, based on a pass/fail system by review where at the end of each semester you set up everything you've done and a group comprised of professors and students comes in and asks questions, looks everything over and makes a determination whether the work you have done is equivalent to the number of credits and level you are supposed to have achieved. Each semester you sign up of classes, but you can freely move around in any other area if you're working on something that you want a blend of media for. For instance, I didn't take any ceramics classes there, but did quite a bit of work in the ceramics area and glaze room and the TAs would fire things for me. When I needed plaster, I'd just go to the plaster room. The only restriction is that if there was a class going on you'd wait for down time. People who are self motivated about making best advantage of the information and fascility there get the most out of it. The Museum School has an MFA program. Unfortunately, though they have a welding area and a concentration on smaller metals, they don't have a foundry.
Massachusetts College of Art, which is two blocks away, does have a foundry. I've been to one of their pours and they make quite an event of it. This one happened to be at Halloween, so the students involved wore death mask face paint and other appropriate accoutrements. They ran three crucibles outdoors in a big courtyard and had a band, firedancers and had made three "sculptures" that would do things when molten metal was poured in them.
All fun aside, I believe they have a good foundry and metals program, will take Museum School students for classes, they are probably more specific about fundamentals and metallurgy than the Museum School is, and Mass. Art is a State Art School (maybe the only one in the country?) so the tuition is lower, even for out of staters, than the average MFA program.
A friend lent me a book on metallurgy. I'll pass on the title to you later.
I recently met a steel sculptor in Alaska when I was there for a short visit and he also has worked quite a bit in Seatlle. Maybe you know him? Mark Fejes.
JAZ
www.joyceaudyzarins.com

[pinballannie]

Thanks for the great responses!

Given that I am at work...and, ahem, working(reeely), I'll have to get back to this later, but just glad to feel some kindred souls out there.

Will post images...afraid I haven't been keeping it up on me, which is very very bad I know. Stay tuned....

Thanks very much for the info on schools, JAZ, and yes please may I have some more?

[Araich]

Hi Anne, welcome :)

I hear you on the insecure thing... funny thing for me, is that in the last few months those feelings have dropped away. It may be that for whatever reason confidence and comfort in the work and choices we've made arrives at it's own leisure. All I can say is that it has not really effected my work, but I have been sleeping like a baby and spending 60 hrs a week in the studio.

[obseq]

Welcome to the board Anne!

Like you I am in the MFA search as well. Incidentally, I was trying to find programs in the Seattle area but could not find anything.

Where are you looking to attend school?

As JAZ mentioned, I am jealous of your foundry access. Outside of having a connection to a foundry as you do, casting is impossibly expensive.

Keep us updated on your school seach and any work you have available to view online.

[fritchie]

Hi all,
Been nosing around in this here joint and I like it! ....... Also looking for more information about metallurgy...been looking for books and not finding much. Wanting to understand the structures in the metal. ......

Welcome, Annie! My background before sculpture was college teaching, in physical chemistry, and my specialization was the structure of crystalline solids, so I actually had a course in the structures of pure metals and metal alloys. My own work was in organic materials, which are very different, of course. I can’t offer references on the atomic structures of metals, but I see JAZ will try to find one.

Sculptorsam’s dodecahedra are found quite often at the atomic level in metals, both pure and alloys. There are many other fascinating arrangements, which I’m sure you will locate.

On casting seedpods and so on: I do bronze exclusively these days, and both my founder and his principal assistant do a lot of similar things. Strawberries, pinecones, small animal bones. leaves, vines, branches, and so on. Usually in combination, but sometimes solo, to combine later.

[fused]

It sounds like you are nestled in a good spot pinball.

[pinballannie]

Thanks for the info about the crystalline structures...it fascinates me. Starting to see that materials sciences and chemistry would have been a good thing to take in college. Ah well. If you have any books to recommend, even textbooks, I would be interested.

Part of the fascination with seedpods and crystalline structures is the relationship of the cellular forms to the greater whole, and the architecture of seeds/pods. Those archetypal forms found on the micro/macro level. Radiolarians also a recent obsession.

Thanks for the reminders that I am in a good spot (I think I need that!)...I know foundry access is a tough thing to find, and I am lucky to have it. I certainly can't afford to have someone cast my stuff, even if I do all the spruing.

Also, a great community at this school...I've learned a great deal from all of my fellow casters/blowers/lampworkers/printers/welders etc.

The rub, however, is that my job is a typical non-profit job, long hours, high burnout (no puns intended, really), and my studio is also my workplace, translating into lots of interruptions for "work" things when I'm here working on my art. (Welding helmets are great for that...no one can tell who you are and don't want to approach you anyway!)

So really the MFA urge is--focus, time, dedication, development.

I think the location I am looking for is NOT in a city but near one...less distractions, cheaper living, and nature. Nothing in Seattle really--a friend just graduated from the U of Washington program and doesn't have the best things to say about it. Really conceptual focus, apparently, and he was focusing on figurative bronze. He talked of doing battle a lot.

I asked this on another post but because I seem to have someone's attention :)
Anyone familiar with encaustic on bronze? I'm looking for a matte finish to one of my recent pieces (finally finished! and yes will post if the digital images come out nicely) and was wondering if encaustic (with the bloom it develops) would do it.

Thanks for the conversation! Wasn't realizing I needed it so much!

[JAZ]

Hi all,
Been nosing around ......Also looking for more information about metallurgy...been looking for books and not finding much. Wanting to understand the structures in the metal.

Well, here's the book I was thinking of.
Basic Engineering Metallurgy by Carl A. Keyser, copyright 1952, Prentice-Hall, NY. (Unfortunately, I see that I've had this book for awhile and am supposed to return it, so I'd better read faster!) Some of the chapters - The Structure of Metals (steel is crystalline! "...crystalline form, which is characterized by a three-dimensional orderly arrangement of the atoms or molecules making up the crystal. Recent studies have indicated that the atoms in metal crystals actually are present in the form of ions. The ions are considered to float in an electron "sea" or "gas", and are so spaced that they form a regular pattern which repeats itself over and over again. All solid metals are crystalline substances of this type."), Mechanical properties and mechanical failure, Phase changes in iron and steel, Copper and zinc, Miscellaneous metals, etc., etc.
The guy who lent it to me also suggested a university bookstore where I might find other used textbooks. Look for a school that has a metals engineering as well as art programs.
Well, that's one suggestion anyway.
JAZ
www.joyceaudyzarins.com
JAZ

[sculptorsam]

On a related note, I was reading in Discover magazine about "Glassy" metals. They use a certain combination of different metals to achieve a disorganized structure, as opposed to the regular crystalline structure you mention. The glassy metal (I believe they make golf clubs out of it now, Liquid Metal) has crazy properties like being super strong, lightweight, bouncy, and the ability to injection mold like a plastic. Very interesting article, could have been from a couple months ago even.

[jwebb]

Come on down to PDX and check out PSU (Portland State U.). I went through there years ago, so don't know if it's all changed, but it was quite a good Sculpture Dep't. Has a decent foundry, a ceramics Lab, good kilns, etc., and is well inegrated with Drawing and painting studios and all the rest. They have an MFA program, and I'd have done that if I could afford it. It is located in the middle of the City, so there is no rah-rah campus atmosphere, as such. 90% of students have jobs and real lives elsewhere, and commute to School. Night classes are as plentiful and full as day classes. Out-of-State tuition could be quite high. I work in the Investment Casting industry, and we have metallurgitsts up the wazoo (no offense to Wash. State U.). You need to know a lot about that if you're trying to make dimensionally exact and "sound" castings without micro-shrinkage, inclusions, etc., becasue they are going into aircraft engines. I don't think a deep knowledge of it is a prerequisite for casting sculpture. But it IS fascinating. There is a cheap, not very deep but quite broad book called "The Complete Metalsmith" by Tim McCreight, which is mainly oriented towards jewelry, but it has a bit on metallurgy, as well as shaping, joining, casting, stones, mechanics and tools. I find it quite useful. It also lists a lot of reference books and suppliers. A guy named Robert E. Lee Hill has a "General Metallurgical Principles" text, which is a lot deeper. That book is all over the place where I work. The subject quickly gets into "phase diagrams" and a quite a bit of math and science. There is also the American Metals Society (AMS) which has a wide array of metals textbooks, and they teach classes in all this stuff, including one called "Metallurgy for the Non-metallurgist", which I actually got through. I hope this helps. Welcome aboard. This site needs more rain-forest-dwellers.

[pinballannie]

Sounds interesting...imagine casting something of that nature.... Herm. Sounds fun. I like casting solid because it's easier for burnout of organics but heavy/spendy/shrinkage, and I seem to choose that size right around where it's a bad idea.

Starting to embed pods in the clay toward making a mold for larger forms...interested in how the fresh pods change during the duration of working on it. Some split and etc. Adds an interesting element to it.

I checked out your website (briefly, sorry) and I like the sense of natural forms put an unusual angles in space. Badly worded I'm afraid but a few struck me as bones/seedpods (like maple propellers) jabbed into the earth at an odd (in life) angle. Suspension of form against gravity. Sigh--me and words today.

Must eat and get back to work. Nice work! Thanks for the tidbits.

[fritchie]

Well, here's the book I was thinking of.
Basic Engineering Metallurgy by Carl A. Keyser, copyright 1952, Prentice-Hall, NY. ............ Recent studies have indicated that the atoms in metal crystals actually are present in the form of ions. The ions are considered to float in an electron "sea" or "gas", and are so spaced that they form a regular pattern which repeats itself over and over again .........


JAZ - Any solid that is a good conductor of electricity (such as most metals) has electrons that are fairly free to move on a large scale. That’s basically what this argument is saying, though it may be novel to nonscientists. The idea of atomic nuclei in metals being ionic, or positively charged, and floating in a sea of electrons, is one that originated in the 1930's. It is correct in essence, of course, and the concept can be stimulating to the general public.

One source I would recommended is the general science monthly, Scientific American. This certainly can be found in university libraries, and probably in most large city libraries. I’ll try to find more specific references.

[fritchie]

........
I asked this on another post but because I seem to have someone's attention :)
Anyone familiar with encaustic on bronze? I'm looking for a matte finish to one of my recent pieces (finally finished! and yes will post if the digital images come out nicely) and was wondering if encaustic (with the bloom it develops) would do it. .........

Annie - Look at this site for the thread Bronzework miniblog (http://www.sculpture.net/community/showthread.php?p=5749#post5749). I use an almost dry paste of ammonia and diatomaceous earth (finely divided particles of silica, from the skeletons of diatoms) to generate a matte finish on bronze. I use it to treat areas ground or cut with metalworking tools.

[JAZ]

JAZ - Any solid that is a good conductor of electricity (such as most metals) has electrons that are fairly free to move on a large scale. That’s basically what this argument is saying, though it may be novel to nonscientists. The idea of atomic nuclei in metals being ionic, or positively charged, and floating in a sea of electrons, is one that originated in the 1930's. It is correct in essence, of course, and the concept can be stimulating to the general public.

One source I would recommended is the general science monthly, Scientific American. This certainly can be found in university libraries, and probably in most large city libraries. I’ll try to find more specific references.
Fritchie,
Scientific American is a good suggestions, especially since my husband subscribes to it. Unfortunately, unlike our index book to National Geographic, we don't have an overall index to S.A. But after I finish my current (time consuming) project - arranging for the installation of six new sculptures for the little sculpture park in Newburyport - maybe I'll take a look and see what we have here in our personal library.
As far as the sea idea, I just really like that concept. The Atlantic is like the blood in my veins, to it's good to think that the steel is too.
JAZ

[lesliepatrick]

MFA....I guess this is short for master of fine arts ?.... no harm in making yourself employable, If you can endure the cloying oppression of study without it affecting your art quality...it would be an asset, maybe in the future lecture for one day a week, and then work for the rest in your studio.....better re-enrol myself come t think of it!

[iowasculptor]

Check it out, I am a grad student in sculpture at Clemson University in South Carolina. I will graduate this spring with my MFA. Anyway they have a great program here it is small but good. The faculty works really hard to help each person be as good as they can be. There is an attitude of building you up so you can do well rather than tearing you down like so many other schools. There are 4 sculpture grads right now but 2 of us are going to be graduating this spring. there are a total of 13 grads in various art disciplines. We have weekly meetings with the sculpture prof and 2 reviews per semester with the entire faculty and also we have 2 walk through/ open studios per semester to get input from other students and faculty. The great thing is that if you get accepted they give you a tuition waver and a grad assistantship which pays a little bit. So you only have to pay for your living expenses. Check it out,
www.clemson.edu
good luck
matt